It would be wonderful if the BBM could make One Press songs easily through drag/drop of loops, similar to most DWAs, without having to use something like GarageBand to do so. I’m hoping when they do release an update, we see why there was such a long delay in features, and we’re all blown away by what they provide us.
As this thread relates to Auto-Pilot I won’t mention the plethora of other issues (let’s be straight here, Bugs!) with the BB manager software. It is a total dogs breakfast. SS have admitted as much by their previous, aborted, attempts to re-write it. It is software that is simply unfit for purpose and it would seem that SS have given up on it and us. And their complete lack of communication about what they are doing (apparently nothing) to make it right tells me that BB is a dead product. Yet they are still pushing it on Facebook ads regularly. Shame on them when they clearly know there are big issues with the management software for the device. Maybe they have a crate load in the warehouse they want to get rid of?
If you are listening SS (doubtful) I would be happy to conduct an open discussion with you to further in my assertions here.
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These days I pretty much use BBManager only for managing song parts and creating the song format, and then exporting the song. I might create a simple beat in there (like a high-hat count-in, or modifying a main beat to create a transition roll or something simple).
I try to minimize my involvement with BBM as much as possible. I use GarageBand for creating beats, stitching midi parts together to make 1 press songs or song parts, etc. I use the BBLoader for managing my card (Huge benefit just right there)
But I’ve made it work. With a little bit of technical savvy you can still make it do about anything you want. The key is to just have a little patience, and more importantly, have a plan for what you want the song to look like. It’d be nice if I could do it all in BBM and everything was seamless. Maybe someday.
But between the existing forum resources and a little technical knowhow it’s been a powerful addition to my live rig.
That said, it is a steep learning curve and I had experience working with IDEs before. But even if you could do all of that inside BBM, that learning curve and need to “have a plan” for the song will still be there. It will still require a decent amount of technical savvy.
My point is that if you want to build it, you can build it. It just takes a little longer and uses a few more tools than you wish it did. I don’t feel like not being able to do it all inside BBM is a dealbreaker. If I want a one press, I make a one press. If I want to combine a verse and a chorus together so it can loop on a single part, I do that. Even with with AutoPLay I probably STILL would want that freedom to configure the song the way they way I want to make it the easiest for me to play and manage along with all my other pedals and looper setup.
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Hmmm @josborn777 , the post by Goran you are replying to seems to have gone. Interesting. Or am I just missing something…
In response to your post, I think you are right if one is prepared to spends many hours playing with computers and software piecing stuff together. Although even then, the part that BBM does do that is needed anyway, the file management and transferring process, is a complete mess. Have you ever looked to see what it spits out onto you local hard drive when you create a project? It is ridiculous.
For me, I want to spend my time playing and practicing for gigs, not nursing a complex collection of software to carry out a function that SS should have provided software to do years ago. Just my view of course.
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I wasn’t actually intending to reply directly to Goran’s post. That was accidental.
I can definitely see how the process is more than a lot of people will want to do. But I think that’s still the case even if the tooling was self contained in BBM. But you can get pretty good at it with experience. I’ve spent about 4 hours working on beats this week but I’ve accomplished a lot:
- Made a DOB for “I Need a Miracle” (Grateful Dead). For this I used some Shuffle beats from the premium Shuffle beats collection. I just assembled the song in Garage Band exported, tested it out in BBM and then exported the .sng.
- Modified a forum OPB for Trucking’ (Grateful Dead). It has some tempo/time signature issues to resolve. It was a very basic beat, so I also added some lead in fills for the verses and choruses to spice it up a little. There were a few places where the bass notes didn’t quite match up in the 7/4 part, so I tweaked those. This was all done in Garage Band. Export midi, Test, Export .sng.
- Created a .sng for Bad Bad Leroy Brown (Jim Croce) using the recommended beat in the song matcher. This was just Save As->Rename->Set Tempo and remove intro, etc. 5 minutes of work.
- Created a .sng for Midnight Rider (Allman Bros) using the recommended beat in the song matcher. This was just Save As->Rename->Set Tempo and remove intro, etc. 5 minutes of work.
- Created a .sng for Whipping Post (Allman Bros). This one was more complicated. I had to create an 11/8 part for the intro and interlude parts. I wanted the entire verse->chorus in a single Part so that I just trigger at the end of the chorus to go into to the 11/8 part. There’s also the build up at the end of the main jam before the last chorus with a couple unique drum parts that I wanted to capture. I used a 6/8 blues beat and then used Garage Band to create the 11/8 beat and the combined Verse/Chorus midi. Then I used BBM to assemble the song and export the .sng file.
A year ago? I wouldn’t have even known where to start on a lot of that work. But now I’ve done dozens of custom songs to fit my needs and I can whip them out pretty quickly if I can find a suitable beat to start with.
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Hi guys, I just wanted to jump in here and tell you what I can.
Autopilot as a feature was never within the design scope when the BeatBuddy was first introduced. This is a feature that we have wanted to build for a long time because we know that it will make the BeatBuddy useful in a whole new context. We understand that playing songs with many song parts can be difficult and confusing and that the Autopilot feature would solve this. This is why we’ve said in the past that we plan to build it.
Again, I’ll emphasize that this wasn’t a part of the original vision for the BeatBuddy, but we still do plan to build it. It will be part of a completely rebuilt BeatBuddy Manager software, which we are currently working on. I will not give any estimated release date, because any estimate will almost certainly be wrong.
I know many of you will not be happy with this statement - the only thing you’ll be happy with is an announcement of the release of perfectly working software. But I thought that saying something is better than saying nothing. And I do want to say, for whatever it’s worth, that I do feel your pain. I want a perfectly working BeatBuddy Manager with Autopilot as well. I know that the BeatBuddy can be so much more to so many more musicians with this software living up to its full potential. All we can do is keep moving forward.
Thank you for your support and understanding.
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Thanks @DavidPackouz. I truly do love this product. In an hour I’ll be rocking a bar downtown in a way that just wouldn’t be possible in a guitar/piano duo otherwise. This pedal, along with a looper and a two talented musician has really made it possible for us to do some cool stuff.
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Dear @DavidPackouz
In response to your post above, I have to say it is little more than a further example of the ongoing patronisation of long time BB users. Users that invested in your start up company by supporting and paying for a product that you seem to have abandoned support for.
Instead you are pushing out more new hardware without ever addressing the fundamental issue with the BB Manager software provided 10 years ago. Despite constant promises of ‘something’ in pipeline, dont know what, dont know when.
Forget Auto-Pilot (for the purposes of this discussion). How about just getting the software
a: Stable
b: Able to installs and function correctly on the current OS platforms (Mac & Windows)
c: Provide the basic operational experience that people deserve and expect from modern GUI software
You are not even close to any of these fundamentals.
And please dont play the pity card 'we are only a small company". I use a number of apps that are essential to my workflow in preparing for professional gigs, that are developed by one-man band development operations and that work perfectly well, install cleanly and exist within the current operating system requirements without issue.
Having worked in software development for 30 years before becoming a full time musician, I am very aware of the structured process involved in delivering a software application. So I would assume that given you have been saying “it is coming” for some years now, you must at the very least have some ‘slide ware’ showing what you intend the new app to look like and what functional points it will address? Maybe even a mock-up prototype? So why not share at least that with the user community? I am not suggesting you provide a detailed project plan with dates etc. Just something to give us some idea of where you are and what you have in mind. After 10 years surely that is not too much to ask?
And please dont try to throw up the smoke-screen that we will only be happy with ‘perfect software’. None of us are naive enough to expect that. But you do need to appreciate that what we have now is so far from perfect that there is a huge area for improvement.
I look forward to hearing your thoughts
Mark
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@DavidPackouz I agree with Mark - very few people here will be only be happy with perfect software.
Two years ago in January 2021 on the other thread about BBM updates you said
We have a better programming team now, and we are starting from the very basics first.
I said :
One general request - once you have the basics in place, please do lots of incremental releases. Do what many other software companies do - have two links on the download page; one stable, fully tested version and one which is the latest version to be used at the downloaders risk. This will build trust that work is really being done and we can see progress. It also enables early adopters to try out new functionality easily and give you quick feedback.
You said
We do plan to do this. We have moved to this type of release schedule for the Aeros and I believe it is a significant improvement.
We’ve not seen this. You did produce the BB loader, but we’ve seen no incremental progress since. If even one person was working on the BBM, we would’ve expected to see some incremental release by now. Which is why we find it difficult to believe that anyone is actually working on it.
Tim
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Guys, this thread is 320 messages long. Did “one press play” ever come out?
I bought my Beat Buddy a couple of years ago for practicing my timing, but now I want to play a whole song to a pre-recorded drum beat that moves me from verses to choruses. Right now I spend so much time trying to manage the foot pedal to transition between rhythmic sections that it is screwing up my playing.
For a standard cover song like Hotel California can’t you just hit the foot pedal once at the beginning and then it will play the whole song through according to a predetermined number of sections?
That seems like a really basic request.
Sincerely,
–Confused
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Phil shared a it in a OPB (one push bass) format. I use NP SuperbassG drumset. Here’s the PBF file of the Eagles by Phil.
EAGLES.pbf (192.1 KB)
You need to import it into BB manager. The first push of the pedal won’t do anything. you have to double click to “end” the song. It plays from start to finish with one ( actually two ) pushes with no way to stop it easily.
all those pre existing forum opb were “to me” a distraction from the true potential of the platform and not what i started purchasing this stuff to do. i already had a laptop and the ability to play midi files.
its seems like the aeros is ready for real looping obp’s?
nothing showing the beatbuddy playing along.?
4th favorite feature the one press song part change.
Well it’s July 2023 and still no auto pilot, is there even a demo or prototype. No I don’t think there is, it’s been so long now I just cannot believe anyone is actually working on it in any meaningful way.
I’m 58 years old and have been a software developer all my adult life, with even a small team of two or three people the whole BBM could have been entirely rewritten by now including auto pilot etc.
I bought mine after reading that the auto pilot feature was almost ready for release, so the fact that auto pilot wasn’t part of BB original vision is irrelevant, it was advertised as a feature before I purchased it.
Like many of us I bought the BB, the extra footswitch and the entire premium collection, I feel kinda foolish now for spending all that money.
Like many others here have said, I’ll not spend another penny with SS until they honour their word and implement this feature. And I will continue to be vocal online and with people I meet about my experience and caution them not to buy SS products if there’s a good alternative!
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Agreed. This is so disappointing and disheartening.
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***UPDATE- i am quitting OnSong as it is a buggy nightmare. They have good ideas but are not a serious software company. I spend more time writing support than playing music. I have found many alternatives. But if you are using Onsong like many BeatBuddy folks, the timeline is cool and seems to work for the most part.
I encourage folks to check out the OnSong feature called Timeline. You can design the song flow and then automated it, (as well as break out of the programmed sequence via tapping or footswitch, etc.) and it will tell beatbuddy when to switch sections, etc. That what I was told and then learned about - though I am not a pro yet. (That is called non-linear- when the program jumps from any section to any other based on your song design, but you can also do it linearly. However that does not send midi commands at each section- i think.). It's a little work for each song but once it's done, it's done. I think that accomplishes the needs people have for this Autopilot. Of course, if you don't use that program or want to , then my suggestion is irrelevant but I think plenty of people do. I actually think Singular Sound needs a master controller and User Interface like that. Currently they have a bunch of parts with various tiny interfaces. Anyway, put that on the list.
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So lots happening all of a sudden on the BB, the online manager and a vst plugin for the DAW.
But this is not what I believed was happening, I was under the impression that SS were redeveloping the BB Manger and inline with this thread an auto pilot feature.
I’ve tried the online BBM , but I didn’t like it. So I’m still using the original BBM. Maybe it’s just me, but I don’t understand the direction here, we wait literally years and then not get what was expected.
I’m sure the VST will be useful to some, and maybe the BBMO works for others. But none of this is really any use to me, I frequently use my laptop in places without internet, and web based GUIs are never anything close to native desktop equivalent.
For me after waiting all this time I’m disappointed, I just wanted an updated desktop BBM with autopilot. Unbelievable !
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Don’t take this the wrong way, but the idea of SS developing an updated BBM in the wake of releasing BBMO seems like you are wasting your time. I could be wrong, but I highly doubt it.
I feel your pain, but it is what it is.
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Yup, agree with you. In some ways the BBMO was a step backwards as it lost some fundamental functions the original BBM had (not having a ‘Save Project as’ to save a project with a different name is really sad). While some users may find BBMO useful, I’m thinking those that have used BBM for a long time will stay with BBM. Not keen on using or relying on online apps either. I hope SS stays around for a long time, as if they should go the way of many small companies, it would be pretty difficult to manage content on the BB unless the person had a copy of BBM available.
Tried the BB VST, have no use for it (using EZ Drummer 3 VST), so will be deleting it from the PC. If I understand correctly the BB VST will become a paid for product to be able to load drum kits other than a default?
I sort of remember what AutoPilot was supposed to do and I don’t think it was something I would have used, so no sleep lost there.
Was surprised that the announcement thread for BBMO currently has 5300 views, but only 55 replies. I would have expected more excitement and response(?)
I once had envisioned a BBM that had an interface much like that of EZ Drummer which would have been awesome, but here we are…
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I’d guess that the BBMO is cleaner code compared to BBM so features such as autopilot are much easier to implement 
It is sad if offline mode doesn’t make it, but it’s not like the desktop BBM would disappear it’s just not developing in any direction 
Let’s hope one day we’ll have an offline BBMO with autopilot 
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