Aeros Loop Nudge request

A feature I would love to see is to be able to nudge a recorded loop right or left in small increments to cleanup timing for off time recorded material. Even with Quantize on I still find the start point is not always directly on time.

Of course an alternative to this os for me to practice more and get better at my start and stop times :slight_smile:

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MIght be useful. The Aeros is a looper DAW and the ability to modify tracks in some way (or simply shift timing) would be useful.

Hey there, I can see the benefit of a nudge in some cases, but implementing the functionality to make these nudges would probably not be so easy, especially if we want it to be specific to a track in a specific song part. This would, however, cause “holes” at the beginning or end of the loop. I also don’t know how realistic it is to expect the Aeros to shift already recorded waveform to a different point in the timeline, will have to ask and see.
For now, practice may be best! :sweat_smile:

Perhaps it’s a “rotate” that offsets the start of the loop (so the last part of the end becomes the beginning).

Not sure SS could stop with just this one feature … not get a lot of issues/feature requests for the DAW.
I think SS has a lot on their plate … and this might spread them even thinner.

Wonder if the DAW is a $25 add-on feature that is an upsell? @DavidPackouz (IMHO a $99 BeatBuddy feature in the Aeros would be higher priority).

This “rotate” idea is spot on… cosign this idea.

I wonder if “rotating” will be truly worth the work it would take to implement both with fade logic and the system for tweaking.

Also, I wonder, @dongothard did you use sync start and length in the song settings? This would make it so all the recordings in freeform have to align at the same start point and so they have to be the same or multiples of the same length.

@BrennanSingularSound Can you explain how and where is this fading occurs? Is it done on demand in real time or does Aeros do the work once and save the audio? Does it happen at the start/stop seam, changing parts, or other places? Not sure anyone here knows what it is supposed to do.

Sync start and length isn’t enough; if the start point of the first track isn’t right, it can be hard to lay down those other tracks in time. And its usually that first track that’s off. That makes it awkward to transition to the next part and back or to stop and start.

Maybe we can solve this issue, and may others (when it comes to editing the recorded contents in a way or the other, nudging, erasing, copying…) by making sure that we can open the file in a DAW, edit to our taste, and as long as the file has been saved with the exact timing under the same name, the Aeros would play it back without throwing an error. Would that be possible? Is that already possible?

The fading becomes an issue once the loop plays back the loop for the first time at the track loop seam. What we have changed is both the processing power (now the tested version of Aeros is using 45 frames of buffer amounting to 2.5ms of DAC latency, it is 30 frames on live version).
This also saves the file incorrectly meaning taking the file out of SD will have audible pop. The solution has been adding the frames and also recording 12ms (I believe) more at each loop’s end to add to the tail of the recording and create a seamless crossfade. I have heard it and it is now seamless.

This is due to RPO on press not being fine tuned, I believe, we can see how this feels with 3.1.x release. Please let us know if you still have this issue later. One solution to your problem is this, see the freeform song to Sync length, record the first track, if you notice timing was off slightly off but still somehow in time, with itself, you can offset the starting point of the part by recording a second part at the correct relative starting point, and making it longer (preferably 2x) than track 1. End of Loop and sync start rules all follow the longest current track in song part.

No, this is not possible, importing to the Aeros is something we hope to tackle soon. For now, we hope to improve the standalone behavior to not need to do that in the first place.

As a general reply to OP request, this is most likely not going to be done, it will be tagged ‘considered’. A function that may override the need for this is a punch i/o feature, but that is advanced and a separate request.

This can also be due to “user error”. I agree that having RPO press working well on the Aeros can be part of this.

But in a lot of cases, the musician’s timing was off … or perhaps started recording on an “off beat” because that’s the intro or groove. That start point being off is not a big deal until you move to the next part.

I can see that, the above process I mentioned would be a way to “correct” the offset from a pick up that is meant to repeat. If it is not meant to repeat and you mean that the previously played sound is entering the recording inadvertently, I would agree that is kind of a user error situation.

There wouldn’t be many workarounds here software-wise, because extra audio would need to be on reserve for all recordings just to allow offsets without holes, and the implementation of a rotation feature would likely make a mess of the loop seam logic. Punch i/o may be better suited, if we go in that route.

In the end, getting the best original take is key here I think, no amount of editing after will be likely to work as well.

I don’t think I explained it well or it got lost in translation.

The original take is often perfect from an audio perspective. You nailed it and it sounds great at the loop seam. There is no missing audio.

The “start” of the freeform loop (which is arbitrary if you have just one part) is offset and perhaps not on beat 1 of measure 1, and that does not matter because of how the end of loop was timed. When you add that second part, then you care that the start of the loop is nudged correctly to “beat 1”.

You can fix almost many issues in the Aeros by re-recording or becoming a better free-form loop artist.

Do you not think using sync start and length is the solution to this problem? Is there a reason it doesn’t work for you in this case? Genuinely curious!

Nope. Sync start and length only works for if the audio in the loop lines up with the loop start. It also does not help with other parts (not other tracks)

Here’s an illustration (using notes to indicate positions in the loop)

You record: “D A B C”. D is the start of the loop as far as the Aeros is concerned.

But you want the start of the loop to be on the A, so you nudge the loop:
“A B C D”

Both loops sound exactly the same, but the nudged one can be used to switch to another part after the D.

Would using only sync length and starting the second track in the A section not do this already? Sure your second loop has to be double the length, but that’s all it would take to reset the starting point to A

Also, I’d suggest you try Change Song Part/ stop All set to End of Loop when in freeform mode, it makes changing parts a little more “quantized”. Paired with sync length you can make freeform act a lot more predictably and musically.

Not even close!

Here an example song:
Part 1: | G G G G | C C C C | (these are two measures, 8 beats total)
Part 2: | C C C C | (one measure)

For whatever reason the user recorded part 1 as: | C G G G | C C C G | . On playback this sounds like | G G G G | C C C C | especially if it’s the only thing playing. But the starting point is off. It should start on a G, not a C.

Need a way to nudge the starting point back to | G G G G | C C C C |

Sorry, we still don’t see ourselves going down this path, but thank you for all your feedback and thoughts.

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Never said it was a high priority!

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