Aeros settings to change location of looper in my signal chain

Here’s an interesting use case for routing:

  • I use the Aeros as an always on pedal at the end of my board.
  • Every once in a while I need to use a looper at the front of my pedal board (to audition various pedal settings to dial in a sound, to dial in the room, to level gain staging across presets, etc.)

Can I route the Aeros so that I can jump back and forth between the above modes without having to change out what patch cords go where each time (or minimize that) ? I know I can do this manually, add a switch box, etc.

The routing settings (below) look like they will work. Would something like this let me change the location of the looper in my signal chain (or some variant like swapping Aux with Main) ?

  • The main in and output go from the end of the pedal board to my amp (normal)
  • I plug my guitar into the Aux In and Aux out is connected to the start of my signal chain.
  • By changing settings (see below) on the Aeros I can switch between the loop recording/playing back on the main versus aux.

Main input routing: Selects where the live sound going into the Main Input is sent. You may select one or both:
● Main Out ● Aux Out

Recording source: Selects which input is recorded. You may select one or both: ● Main In

● Aux In
Note: There must at least one recording source.

Loop playback routing: Selects where the Loop Playback is sent. You may select one or both:

● Main Out

● Aux Out
Note: The loop playback must be sent to at least one output.

Aux In Routing: Selects where the live sound going into the Aux In is sent. You may select one or both:

● Main Out ● Aux Out

Looper at end of pedal board:
Guitar (mon) -> Aeros Aux In -> Aeros Aux out -> Pedal Board In (mono) -> … -> Pedal Board Out -> Aero Main In (loop playback, live) -> Aeros Main Out

Looper at front of pedal board:
Guitar (mono) -> Aeros Aux In - (loop playback, live) > Aeros Aux out -> Pedal Board In (mono) -> … -> Pedal Board Out -> Aero Main In -> Aeros Main Out

I’m being a bit lazy asking about this (versus testing it out). In fairness, I don’t think I have the right patch cables (stereo to mono, length) to test this out (and would need to disassemble the board). I’m also not sure what was planned versus released in firmware updates.

I suspect plugging into the Aeros twice might have some small impact to sound quality and latency. Probably worth it though, If it really bugged me, I could get rid of it when the Aeros was moved to the end of the chain (by manually swapping my guitar cable to the front of the chain)

It’s been my understanding that a loop order switcher needs to be integrated into the hardware design from the start, a pre/post thing, if you will. The Eventide H9 and the big Strymon pedals have this. I could be wrong, but that’s what I’ve always thought.

I think my biggest question is why you need to plug the clean guitar signal into the Aeros through the Aux In if you are not going to record it? You could just plug your guitar directly into your pedals and from the end of the Pedal chain connect your output from pedals into Aeros Main in L (mono) and Main Out L (mono) into the amp. Even better, you can then have the Aux out free and route it to a monitor so you can hear the pre-amp signal with all the processing.

Does this make sense? Am I misunderstanding your set up?

That’s the way it is setup now and it only supports looping the wet sound:

Guitar -> pedals -> Aeros -> amp

I also need to loop the dry guitar signal into the pedals (but no need to loop the wet mix at the same time):

Guitar -> Aeros -> pedals -> amp

Using the routing of the aux and the main lets me switch between the two setups by changing the Aeros settings. Per the Aeros documentation of the settings it should work.

That is a good idea, but not required. Most pedals don’t have multiple channels that are routable.

What is required is enough inputs/outputs and flexible routing. The Aeros has both and may support limited loop order switching whether or not it was designed to do that.

Fyi, I find it easy to get confused by the two uses of the word “loop” in our posts.

Loop order with looper at front:
Guitar -> Aeros -> pedals -> amp

Guitar -> Aeros Aux In - (loop playback, live) > Aeros Aux out -> Pedals -> Aero Main In -> Aeros Main Out

Loop order with looper at end:
Guitar -> pedals -> Aeros -> amp

Guitar -> Aeros Aux In -> Aeros Aux out -> Pedals -> Aero Main In (loop playback, live) -> Aeros Main Out

The use of aux in the second scenario is just as a pass thru (as is the main in the first scenario). This allows switching between the two scenarios just by Aeros software settings. The cabling remains the same.

Phew. This makes my head spin.

Perhaps let me ask @BrennanSingularSound a simpler question. Is the documentation of the routing I posted above correct and completely implemented?

If so, then the above setup should work.

1 Like

If your question is if the routing settings on the Aeros work, they do!

1 Like

I verified that it is possible to move the “location” of the looper via routing … and it works really well! This is pretty powerful.

Here are some common uses for the looper at the front:

  • Auditioning IR’s
  • Volume Leveling/Gain Staging across Presets
  • Tweaking various knobs and params on your pedals/modeler
  • Some forms of (ambient) looping where you want the loop sound to change as you play with the effects.

You only need two extra cables over the standard setup: Guitar -> Aeros Aux In -> Aeros Aux Out -> Pedals -> Aeros Main In -> Aeros Main Out -> Amp

Initial setup (one time):

  • Main Input Routing: Main Out
  • Aux In Routing: Aux Out

Settings to swap the loop to the end of pedalboard:

  • Recording Source: Main In
  • Loop Playback Routings: Main Out

Settings to swap the loop to the front of pedalboard:

  • Recording Source: Aux In
  • Loop Playback Routings: Aux Out

Toggle the Aeros settings and the looper moves to the desire location. It’s complicated to describe, but really easy in practice. IMHO this is better than a second looper or swapping patch cables back and forth.

1 Like

Two caveats to the post above.

I used long guitar cables as I did not have patch cables that were long enough and the cables were on top of the power supply, etc. The noise floor sounds about the same as the “normal” setup except with high gain patches. I suspect that is related to the louder volume (probably due to mono cable summing I describe below); need to play around with this.

Always the potential for more ground loops and noise the more connections you have between boxes; YMMV

I used mono cables to/from the aux in/out. This passively splits the mono to aux-in L & R … and then passively sums them together from aux-out L&R. Suspect the net effect is a boost as the two channels are merged. Could possibly lead to some phasing, degradation, or noise (at the same effective volume). I have a few ideas on improving this:

  • Since the Aeros has separate master L & R jacks (and stereo TRS aux jacks), swap the roles of master and aux in the above setup … and only connect to one channel of the master.

    • Only drawback here is that Aeros does not (currently) display the levels of the Aux input which is key to prevent clipping.
  • There is no setting for the Aux In Level to choose between Instrument or Line-In (like there is for the Main-In). Not an issue for my setup.

  • Use some sort of cable breakout to TRS cables for aux in (perhaps aux out as well) to only connect to one aux channel (e.g., just the left one) and ground the other one. This sounds easy but is harder in practice due to non-standard cabling on a tight pedal board.

  • Add a feature in the Aeros that allows muting (fade) the Left or Right Aux Out (or In) channel. Others have asked for more advanced mixing and control of the aux. Alternately add some aux out mode that chooses between Stereo, Left Only, and other choices like Dual Mono Left, Right Only, Dual Mono Right, Mono Sum R&L

Very interesting, consider it in consideration!

We are aware of the Aux in level meter issue, we are looking at possible solutions

The Line in vs instrument in for the Aux is an interesting one, not sure if there will be any limitations from hardware there.

We are also looking into advanced routing control like dual mono, but that may not be until after we get through auto-quantize at least.

2 Likes

I think I’ve worked around this using twoTSR patch cables. Might not work for all setups. Not sure I’d use a TSR for my instrument cable, but I happen to have a wireless at the front of my board (with an input Jack in case of interference/battery life).

This is working really well.

Only minor complication is connecting a mono device to the stereo aux in and out. I’ve had success using stereo cable to avoid “passive mixing the LR channels”. This is standard device wiring stuff, and the Aeros’s use of stereo aux jacks is more than fine.

Very small feature request that would make this a bit easier to use: Move Loop Playback Routing setting

Is it not a problem running guitar level into the aux in (which i think is line level)?

I haven’t noticed that being an issue.

I use a Boss WL-50 in front most of the time which has a buffer, but haven’t had an issue when I bypass it. If you’re worried about it, you could use a tuner as a buffer.