Beatbuddy and VL3(x) Sync Problems / not been taken seriously into account ??

Hello all…
I’m going to weigh in here because I too have issues with the BB and VL3 syncing properly. First let me explain that I use Yamaha MD-BT01 wireless bluetooth devices for my set up because it’s faster, has low latency, and best thing…no wires!
Now what I have discovered is that the VL3 operates in two ways with regard to the presets in the VL3 when it comes to tempos.
The first is the “Global Tempo” setting. This setting should be set to OFF if you want the presets (which refers to the delays, etc.) to operate using the default tempos that are set in each preset. YES, those presets tempos can be changed to whatever BPM you want it to be, but it does become the preset’s DEFAULT tempo. (that’s a problem, because it won’t change to whatever the midi message says to change to). The second way is to have the Global Tempo set to ON. This will set ALL presets to whatever tempo you set…the same tempo! That one doesn’t make sense to me because every song is played at a different tempo, but whatever…there is still the problem of the tempo not changing to the tempo I need the VL3 to be when I use the looper.

That said folks, that is where the problem of syncing the BB and VL3 is…for me anyway. Because when I send midi messages via Onsong, messages are received, all of my devices change to what presets I want them to be, but the tempo change command that I send only changes in the BB. It doesn’t change the tempo in the VL3. But because of the default tempo in the presets in the VL3, it changes to whatever the preset tempo is.
(I have emailed TC Helicon on a few occasions regarding this in hopes that they will simply add a few things to the firmware so that one can use all the devices they want using either a midi cable, or wifi, or (my favorite) a bluetooth device.

Now I did have the BB and VL3 connected via the midi cable previously and it did work, but there was a delay in the tempos matching up…but they did eventually match up. That is one of the reasons I switched to using bluetooth. The changes are instant on both devices! The problem with using wifi or bluetooth when it comes to sending midi messages, is that you CANNOT have the midi clock on. If you have it on, you will see a constant change in the tempo on both devices. That’s because a midi clock is constantly sending thousands of pulses, so the devices will keep changing. Sure they stay near the tempo you want, but who wants to be playing at an unstable tempo? Fast then slow…Fast then slow! one or two ticks…sometimes 3 or 4!
If I can just get TC Helicon to update their firmware so that the VL3 and like kind products will (bypass) the default tempos, we’ll be golden!!
I suggested that they add another option selection under the “MIDI” tab where the “midi tempo” is. Presently it only shows “ON” or “OFF”
If they will add a window that has the options “Cable” and “Bluetooth” and “Wifi” to make it so the VL3 recognizes what a user is using to communicate with the VL3 and like kind devices, I think the “TEMPO” sync issues will be eliminated.

Your thoughts?


I only understood some of what you said
Is it anything like this sort of thing?

Just out of curiosity. I do not have a dog in this fight, since I am not a VL3 owner, but I have other midi devices that use a midi sync (Pigtronix Infinity and Roger Linn Adrenalinn 3.) Has anyone tried the iOS midi clock apps as a master clock? (MidiFlow, MidiBus). Because if that works, how about having a Yamaha MD-BT01 hooked into a midi splitter, and then having a separate cable midi cable going in to your each of your devices. Since they are all receiving the same clock, should they not then sync, and would this not eliminate the VL3 issue of having to catch up with the tempo? And , if I’m off my rocker here, that’s nothing new, just trying to be outside of the box.

You guys are providing some good input. My disclaimer to all of this is, I am not midi savvy and can only speak to my experience between BB and VL3 connected via the cable.

As for the delay, I’m wondering if you are talking about the one or less second delay for VL3 to catch up with the BB tempo? my understanding from TC-Helicon, this is an expected drift.I know in my early testing I let VL3 and BB run for an hour, with the so called expected +/-1 drift

And, while I am learning a lot from Phil and Aaron’s posts, I have to refer back to the opening tone of this thread that expresses more of a general, it doesn’t work do something about it, but does not lay out specifically in detail the steps we can try also to reproduce a potentially credible issue and validate the report. I think it is important to move away from other generalizations like, I have the latest firmware, etc. I am not dismissing the idea there are issues, but rather just trying to get the specifics based on how the problem is presented.

As much as I appreciate the thread, unless it picks up, I will watch it simmer ~ sigh.

Ok, I’ve not read through the last few comments just yet, Im going to go over Aarons comment in a minute but just wanted to update that Ive had a minor breakthrough this evening. When I toyed with the Metronome functions on the VL I got somewhere. I’m in such a hurry I just wanted to stop by and say that but will document everything better when I get a chance. (God I hate having to go to work lol)

Ha ha… thanks for the mini update Trevicus

Hey Phil,
I believe that your suggestion would work, but I have gone the route of having all bluetooth devices on my music devices…mainly to alleviate a bunch of cables/wires. I’ve succeeded in doing that, but I just can’t seem to get the VL3 to change to whatever tempo I tell it to by way of midi messages. The way my set up is now, everything is communicating via bluetooth. My problem is only the VL3 at this point. If it wasn’t for the default preset tempos everything would be fine because the VL3 would change to what I ask it to change to…not to what it already has in it’s memory.

Hey Lovesinging,
I want to say yes from the looks of it. I don’t know anything about Ableton Link.
It would appear that the video is showing how to link up iOS devices with DAWs or iOS sound module apps like Sampletank via Wifi using Alberton Link.
I’m simply trying to sync up my Voicelive 3 using a bluetooth device that is paired up with my iPad Pro which has Onsong, and from Onsong I send midi messages to my music devices.
So I want to say yes to your above question.

Thanks Aaron I am tempted to try such a setup but I use an old ipad2…so no bluetooth yet

Your iPad 2 has bluetooth capabilities, so it would pair up with whatever bluetooth device you connected…should anyway.
It will also depend on whether or not your music devices have midi-thru like the BeatBuddy does, so it communicates with it quite easily. If the music device does NOT have midi-thru, then you’ll have to have a merger or splitter to route through.
I’m not going to pretend to know everything about how this all works because I’m still working out some things myself obviously! lol
I have, however, started the journey using bluetooth/wifi and I’ve had success. Just a couple more kinks to figure out and I’m golden.
I’m sure someone has already worked them out in their journey, so I will continue to pick some brains! :slight_smile: