Something is wrong

I updated BB manager and tweaked some kits (set choke group 0, etc…) and I re-did a whole bunch of songs with much tighter bass, they sound perfect through BB manager, but after sync to pedal, all bass notes sustain horribly on the pedal.

How do I get the pedal to play back new kits and fixed midi bass correctly?

I understand the pedal will need a firmware update the achieve the bass note off, non choke group thing, is that true?

Once again very confusing for many of us. I do not understand why someone cannot break this down a bit more in simple terms in what is going on. We cannot be alone in how our songs song awful with cracks and pops after the update. For example what does “nonperc” stand for? Where did the term perc come from and why was that chosen? If this should be obvious I am sorry. Is it a setting on the BB or is it a type of kit. Why do you have perc vs. nonperc kit now. Sounds like nonperc is the ticket but it may need new firmware? How does perc then differ from preexisting kits we have used? Also why do my notes sustain all over each other when using nonperc? Thanks again to those who know more than us in trying to explain this.

Absolutely agree with you that none of this makes sense. I would look up aashideacon’s recent posts to read his thoughts on noisy bass notes. Meanwhile, here’s the answers to some of your questions:

  • nonperc is short for Non-Percussion (drum set); there’s nothing to say you can’t change the drum set’s name to something more suitable such as Mod Vintage Ludwig with Bass. The name change is to identify a drum set that has the Choke Group set to 0 and the Instrument Type changed from Percussion to Non-Percussion. This is done in the BBM to change how the BBM handles note offs for bass notes; the firmware has some catching up to do.
  • perc is short for Percussion and both abbreviations come from the Instrument Type in the drum set editor in the BeatBuddy Manager; if you have not modded a drum set’s Choke Group and Instrument Type, then there is probably no need to change the name of the kit.
    My 2 cents’ worth? While the edits and name changes work for some users, we all have different thoughts on how to make it suit our work habits.
  • you edit the drum set using the BBM Drum Set editor and you can look up how to do this on the forum, or follow the simplified steps below
    • in BBM, select the Drum Set tab
    • double-click a Drum Set to edit; the kit will open
    • in the Drumset Maker window, scroll down to your first bass note (could be Midi ID 62-64)
    • click the note name e.g., 64_E-1(Vol -10db Choke Group 2) and a sub-window opens where you can edit choke group and instrument type (change Choke Group from 2 to 0; change Instrument Type from Percussion to Non-Percussion)
    • do this for every bass note in the kit
    • when complete, double-check your work
    • double-click the name of the drum set in the Project Explorer Drum Sets tab to save it
    • you can change the name of the drum set you just changed when its font is not italicized (double-click on another drum set to get your target kit to change to a non-italics font)
    See the screen shots I’ve included

Thanks Persist- I get it now. I appreciate the screen shots and now it all makes sense. 1 more question. I have downloaded some Nonperc drum sets. When I run the nonperc sets the bass notes all sustain over each other. Should this be happening? Is this what you mean the firmware needs to catch up? I think I assumed that the nonperc kits I have in my possession would work with 1.85? If it is because of the firmware that the bass notes are all sustaining over each other, I will stop playing around with this in trying to reduce the cracks and pops with nonperc kits and just keep playing the PERC kits I already have and wait it out. Though the cracks and pops are annoying, when I play over them with guitar they are not as noticeable. Thanks for the excellent support.

P.s. I am running Firmware 1.85 and Manager 1.64.

Sustaining all over each other in both the BBM and pedal or just the pedal? You will just have to preview the perc and the nonperc kits to hear which one sounds the best for any given song you play on the pedal.

Sounds fine in manager but on the pedal the notes do not cutoff and sustain over each other. I have only tried the Vintage Ludwig perc vs. non perc kit. So I will try some others. So it is not about the firmware?

Check your e-mail in just a couple of minutes.

I’m having a similar issue. With the non-percussion, notes sustain longer than they should. I had to go back to using choke groups, but the bass lines didn’t sound the same, even though they sound fine on BB Manager. Did anyone find a fix for this? Or is this something we’ll have to wait for a firmware update?

Do you still have the midi? If you re-import it, it will fix it. There are probably no note-offs in your midi. The old midi importer stripped them out as the beatbuddy didn’t use them. Now that we recognize note offs to make bass sounds better etc, we import them. If you re-import the midi it will work. Also, the next release is coming out, and will have an export midi that will fix the no-note-off issue.

I still have the MIDI. I can’t remember when I imported the songs, but I thought it was after the latest BB Manager release. I’ll have to check and see. However, thanks to Persist, I have the bass working on BB fine now.

sometimes when I try to load/play a newly released sng …
I have to open the song files & quantize them as they won’t play properly w/out doing so first.
It sounds like either drums or bass is incomplete , until after the quantizing.
… then it always plays properly.

Is there any other solution if no original midi? I use sonar as midi editor

If you don’t need to quantize the song, another technique is to open the BBM Midi Editor and check that there is a kick drum loaded in the proper position. If it is, just Cancel out of the Midi Editor and chances are that all of the instruments will have now loaded correctly. Sometimes it takes 2-3 times to load correctly. DO NOT however, press Apply at any time in the Midi Editor or the bass note-offs will not sound properly; use Cancel instead.

You could try asking the user that posted the song to the forum in a conversation (private message) if they still have the original midi. Sometimes users have them. This is one of the reasons I try to always post the midi song source and the midi files (the one with the edited and joined tracks) with any song I post to Resources.

Thanks for your reply, unfortunately I cant find the originals for some of my work.
Couldn’t believe it cant be fixed in editor such a sonar and then sent back to BBM?

You can try but the various DAWs handle midi note-offs differently.

There is a problem with the internal midi editor. When you apply changes, it strips the note-offs.

However, I have fixed the midi exporter to detect if note-offs are present, and if they are not, I add them back in. It’s not a perfect solution because i have to fix the duration of the note to a fixed time.