I just can’t get the Aeros to work the way I expect with the BeatBuddy. I’m using midi sync. The tempo syncs fine to the Aeros. If I hit record or play before the measure, it will start recording or playing on the measure which is great. However, if I hit record exactly on the beat, it doesn’t start recording until the next measure.
I just downloaded 2.17.1 as I thought this might fix it with the change from release to press button, but I get exactly the same issue.
All I really want to do is loop chord progressions to put solos into my acoustic songs. I’ve been doing this for years with a ditto X2. I’d really love to use the Beatbuddy live but until I can reliably loop, its a non-starter.
Hey there, the issue is, the Aeros is a completely new way of looping. We are totally aware of many guys like you that are used to pressing functions as close as possible, if not right on, the beat. The Aeros makes use of its visual interface to allow you to set up recordings and playback to the next measure/immediately(freeform) , or following the Sync Start/Length rules. I understand that it can be hard to unlearn the way you used previous pedals, but I think you will really like the way the Aeros works once you get more used to the style of workflow.
Now, while you’re playing in the last measure of a part in quantized mode, you should be pressing buttons, either giving a playback, record, or next part command. You have to be thinking ahead of the beat. Using the Length and Start features makes it so that you could set up playback/recording even earlier than the measure before.
This deviates from what all loopers before have done, so it is a change in the intuition, but we think it is how a looper should behave in the 21st century
I’m in the market for the Aeros now cos of how it works closely with the BB, but not sure I like the sound of this. It means you have to think twice i.e. 1.press button 2.Start chords or whatever
If its on, or near the beat you only have to do that once as one movement.
Could there not be an option to make it also work how people have been doing it for years? otherwise you might put some people off?
I have come to appreciate the way it works by setting up early and I do like it. However when I go back to free mode without the BeatBuddy, I need to go back to hitting it on the beat.
You definitely get used to it, but when you have to swap between on the beat and before the beat depending on how you are set up leads to many errors.
I really like the approach you have taken with setting the loop up early.
However, I really think it’s a mistake to treat a click on the beat as meaning a user wants to start recording in the next measure - 4 beats away.
Sure, any click AFTER the beat could mean the the next measure, but ON the beat makes no sense at all. If someone tried to use it that way, there is a danger of clicking slightly early and the recording start straight away. Unusable: to set up a loop early, you need to stay well away from that beat.
Is there an underlying architecture/caching issue or is this purely a functional decision?
Hi Brennan. Yeah are you talking about what the infinity calls trail mode i.e.foot pedal actions happen at the loop boundary? Wouldn’t it be possible to have an option for normal mode too i.e. when you press near or on the loop boundary it triggers the next action immediately?
Sounds like some people would like a “recording forgiveness” option that let’s them to specify some time period to “click on the beat”.
I’m all for the looper providing ways to “queue up” actions in advance so i can “focus on playing on time, not tapping buttons on time”. For me, this is best. I also think that one size does not fit all … especially for a looper … and people expect more out of an expensive looper. There’s a long tail of options like this which will make Aeros the greatest looper in the world.
In the end, it’s SS’s product (and @DavidPackouz baby) and they are more than in the right to say, “this is how it is”. SS also actively listens to feedback for users … which leads to a better product (and has limits).
P.S. A healthy amount of skepticism is useful when people say “this is best” or “this cannot be done”.
@Quad I like the queuing up as well. It’s great to not be so busy and click anywhere during the bar. The visuals make this so easy.
However can anyone describe a use case where if someone clicks exactly (or as close as doesn’t matter) on the 1 beat, they would want the action to start in the next bar?
You always need to stay well clear of the 1 or you will get an unpredictable result. The current functionally means click whenever you want - but never on the 1.
If this is difficult to develop, then I get it. If it’s a design decision - I just don’t get where the benefit is.
You can press it on the 2 or the 3. Doesn’t have to be on the one. It’s just a matter of getting used to how it works. Only took me a few days after using Boss loopers for a couple of years.
Ok guys this is my response to this:
There is no current issue with setting up recording. In fact, there is a 300ms forgiveness for being late to a measure, and the Aeros (on the current beta 2.17.x) will always fill the hole created because it is always recording the last 300ms of audio for just such an occasion.
The biggest stumble for guys used to other loopers would probably be playback. In fact, the need to be so close to the beat has made some guys a little late to the measure maybe a few ms (due to the playback button being on the release). Causing the Aeros to read the playback as being set up on the following measure (or whatever the rules for sync tracks may be at that time). The idea is the Aeros gives you the ability to set up playback before the measure closes. You could be at beat 2 and closing the loop up to the next anchor point(depending on sync rules). This gives you the ability to close one loop and set up another ahead of the command being enacted. Much like pre-roll in a DAW or recording setting.
So one thing is needing to get used to playback being on release vs press, which is what allows for the hold commands on that button. Another thing is getting used to setting up and timing your use of the Aeros so that it enhances your playing, live songwriting, and performing; we know it’s different but we think it’s a good difference.
@BrennanSingularSound What you said would be fantastic but it’s not what I’m experiencing. My timing may not be perfect but I’m not 300m/s off the beat. This is using the new beta version 2.17.1.
I’ve tried this both ways with the new option set to press and release (which shouldn’t matter as that doesn’t relate to the record button anyway.
Sorry - not the best video but I’ve tried to demonstrate as simply as I can.
This is an atypical use for the Aeros, The reason being the 300ms forgiveness is not applicable to the very first recorded track if the Aeros is stopped, the first set up is meant to enact at the following measure. Is there any reason, you can’t set up the recording prior to the one of the first measure your want looped?
I would highly suggest you allow the Aeros to respond to the Start command with playback. If the Aeros is playing back, the 300ms will be saved, and you will have the first track forgiveness you need.
OK I have changed midi in start to playback and now it will record on the beat. So now I see that it’s in a different mode where it is listening for input and can hence work within that 300 m/s window.
I still don’t fully understand what is the the benefit of this approach. There is at least one down side though. For songs that have a stop, I use a pause on the beatbuddy. If I have previously used a loop in a song (which I will often do at the intro), the loop starts up again.
Anyway - can certainly live with that. Many thanks @BrennanSingularSound for your help with this.
Can’t wait to see what the Aeros has in store in the future.
Agreed, Brennan. It’s the reason I wanted Aeros. I want the freedom to poke the ‘Next’ button before the precise time, and let the looper decide when to start recording based based on a preset time interval… pretty much like Ableton Live does.
Really, you don’t have to think twice. I felt the same way when I first got my Beatbuddy, Aeros looper, and theMidi Maestro. In fact, I almost returned them, but I decided to give them one more try. Am I ever glad I kept them now! Often times when looping, you also have to switch other gear, bass pedals , guitar effects, vox effects etc etc. With so many things to switch, there is no way to do them all at the exactperfect time. Look at the looper the same way. You now have time to activate the looper any time during a measure proceeding when you want the looper to do it’s next action, meanwhile giving you time to hit a few other switches as well. Once I got used to this idea, the smoothness of my entire show increased dramatically. I have used/owned almost every looper out there, and nothing else that I have used even comes close to the combination of gear from Singular Sound. Nothing
